Heal Within with Dr. Evette Rose
Hi, I am Dr. Evette Rose, a Holistic Counsellor, Ph.D., MBA, and Author of 21 books, Mental Health and Trauma Recovery Therapist. Join my weekly updated holistic content where I host Mini Masterclasses, and meditations and discuss overcoming life challenges, healing work, business, depression, anxiety, happiness, divorce, relationships, finances, boundaries & trauma.
Plenty of my discussions are based on my book Metaphysical Anatomy Volume One maps over 722 physical ailments to their underlying emotional, psychological, and trauma-based root causes. It has become a global resource for those seeking to understand how their nervous system, subconscious, and emotional patterns influence long-term health. You will love this book and our Metapsychology Coaching Techniques!
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Heal Within with Dr. Evette Rose
Season 9 - Episode 80 - A Sobering Truth Behind Success | Dr. Evette Rose and Ron Malhorta
The quest for authentic masculinity in today's world feels increasingly complex. How can men maintain ambition, leadership, and strength without falling into toxic patterns? Award-winning wealth planner Ron Malhotra cuts through the confusion with crystal clarity in this powerful conversation.
Drawing from personal experience, Ron shares his transformation from a confused young man with misdirected energy into a purpose-driven leader. He challenges conventional thinking about masculinity, arguing that the problem isn't masculine traits themselves but the lack of guidance in channeling them properly. "Toxic masculinity was maybe a label given to men who have the capability to be strong men of character and lead but don't have the direction," he explains. This perspective shifts the conversation from suppressing masculine qualities to developing self-mastery.
Ron introduces a revolutionary framework for male development centered on four pillars: mastery of self, business and financial fundamentals, understanding spiritual laws, and embracing healthy masculinity. This holistic approach addresses what traditional education neglects – character development alongside practical wisdom. He draws a crucial distinction between internal identity (purpose, values, strengths) and external identity (title, accomplishments, status), revealing how attachment to external factors creates vulnerability during life's inevitable challenges.
Perhaps most profound is Ron's insight on balance. Rather than choosing between polarities – dominance or passivity, expression or stoicism, intellect or intuition – men must learn when each quality serves them. "It's not about whether you have ego or show emotion," he explains, "it's about knowing when and how much is appropriate." This nuanced understanding transforms confusion into clarity and weakness into strength.
Ready to reclaim your masculine power with purpose and consciousness? This episode offers a roadmap to becoming the kind of man who remains strong yet grounded, ambitious yet ethical – a true asset to family, business, and community. Share your thoughts about balancing masculine energy in today's world!
Hi everyone, yvette Brose here from Metaphysical Anatomy Guys. I am so excited here to have on the Men in Business Summit. We have a special guest speaker, ron Malhotra. Ron, thank you so much for being here.
Speaker 2:Thank you, it's a pleasure. Thank you for inviting me, yvette.
Speaker 1:So excited. I have a good feeling about this interview. When we started like this, I know it's going to be fantastic. And so, guys, for those of you who don't know Ron, he loves to elevate human talent and also the consciousness through education, and he's also an award-winning wealth planner, renowned and also a thought leader, entrepreneur, international best-selling author and also a speaker and a business mentor. And he's also the founder of the Successful Mail and also the managing director of Maple Tree Wealth Management and Black-Footed Business Advisor, amongst many other things.
Speaker 1:I wonder if I really had to say everything that you've done, everything that you have accomplished in your life. That would take up the whole interview. Congratulations, first of all, with being so well accomplished. You know your life is fantastic, You're doing great, You're exactly where you want to be in your life. But has it always been like that for you? Has it always been easy? Because I see sometimes men who are very successful it's because they've had perhaps a role model or a positive introduction to it. But then we also have the opposite extreme, where people have had nothing and they come from that place of humbleness and then creating the life that they wanted. How did this start for you?
Speaker 2:well, I don't think I'm necessarily very accomplished. I think it's. This is just a byproduct of age, along with focus, right? So I am 44 years of age, and once you know what you want to do in life, then you obviously accumulate accomplishments as you go along, provided you know what you want, because if you know what you want, you're not wasting a lot of time. So I think once I got focused and once I knew exactly who I was and what I wanted, I was surprised at how quickly the accomplishments piled up.
Speaker 2:I am achievement orientated, uh, admittedly I am. I am driven by achievements, uh, but I don't want the achievements to define me. I want the character to define me. I want the character to define me. But no, it hasn't been this way always. I mean, I started off as a very confused, frustrated young man, very confused and no direction.
Speaker 2:By the time I was in my late teens. I had a lot of friends who were alpha males in terms of their ability to be able to go out, a lot of macho, bravado and confidence, but the depth was missing, the character was missing, that consciousness was missing. So I did learn a lot of things just hanging out with those guys. I learned how to be confident. I learned how to be strong. I learned a lot of the masculine skills by hanging out with men like that. The problem, though, was when it really came down to maturity taking responsibility. They lacked in that. So who I am today, I attribute to the input of wonderful mentors that I've had over the years. I really strongly believe that it's because of them that I'm here, because've had, I've had.
Speaker 2:I guess I did my part. I took the initiative to learn to fill in all the gaps, but I was always hungry as well. One of the things I find is that a lot, of, a lot of people are not on the quest for truth and wisdom, so I think I think our part is that we need to have the thirst for wisdom and truth, and I think when you have that and you realize that you've got a lot of gaps in your knowledge, you've got to seek out the right people. So I stand on the shoulders of giants. I am extremely confident now. I know who I am, I know what I want.
Speaker 2:I think I have a fair understanding of how things work, how life works, but that I attribute to the learnings and the input that I've had from wonderful people in my life, but it started out me being very confused. I was always ambitious, but I didn't know how to direct my ambition. And when you, when you're a young man, you're full of testosterone, you're full of energy, but if you don't have the right role models around you, you don't have mature men of character, you don't have responsible leaders around you, then you end up misdirecting a lot of that energy, which is what happened with me. So I ended up misdirecting a lot of that energy. I was, I was feisty, I was, I had the fire inside of me, but you know, a fire, uncontrolled fire, is not a good thing. Yeah, so I did become self-destructive, and I think I became destructive in my relationships as well. And because I had all this fire but I didn't channel it, not knowing what my purpose in life was, not knowing who I was in terms of my strengths and my values, a lot of that fire either got dissipated in a hundred different directions or it became destructive to me and the people around me.
Speaker 2:And so that's when I realized that there are men like me out there who have a desire to be a leader, or they have the ambition, but it's uncontrolled ambition.
Speaker 2:And when I started to hear about toxic masculinity, I started to understand that toxic masculinity was maybe a label given to men who have the capability to be strong men of character and lead but don't have the direction, who have the capability to be strong men of character and lead but don't have the direction. And so all that energy that's pent up and it doesn't have a channel for expression can then become destructive. And so that's why, when we decided that we wanted to set up an initiative to show ambitious men who want to become men of character, they don't want to tone down their ambition, they don't want to lose their masculine energy. They just want to learn how to redirect it. Remain men, but redirect it in a way that's going to make them an asset to their families and their communities and their industries. And having gone through that problem, solving that problem myself, I felt it was my obligation to bring that education to men. And that's how you know, my background connects to the successful men.
Speaker 1:I love what you touched on there.
Speaker 1:You touched on something so fundamentally important because I you know, with all the other men that I spoke to, you touched on something that I haven't really touched on yet, and that is all this fire, all this energy, all this creativity.
Speaker 1:They have the talent, but it's all about channeling and funneling and structuring that correct. And what I also see here if we really had to look at it from a bit of a psychology type of perspective, do you feel that it comes from a need to avoid feeling controlled or having to follow the mainstream, or wanting to be different or wanting to stand out, that men might not necessarily want to follow the rules or have to do it in a certain way, but try to find their own innovative way to do that. But there's always that, that it's almost like there's that key, that missing gap that allows them to really bridge these talents that they have to a constructive outcome. What would you say was one of the biggest pitfalls when you did have this wild energy that you just wanted to push, put out into the world, and where did you find your, your how can I say?
Speaker 2:your mishaps were when, when doing that I think anytime you're going to try and understand a problem, you have to first start with why the problem exists. So let's talk about why the problem exists. Well, first of all, there are very few leaders who have depth of character, a sense of morality and ethics in the world. Let's face it moral and ethical education is not part of our education system. So we don't really have a lot of role models. In a community, like we used to back in the day, you'd have men who were role models. They were strong men and you know, young men would have to go and do service in the armed forces and they would learn a lot of those skills. When I grew up, you know a lot of men were already not that strong and I found that there was a lack of role models. Combine that with the fact that the education system, the traditional education system, emphasizes academic education. It doesn't. It doesn't emphasize self-education, it doesn't emphasize spiritual education, it doesn't acknowledge the importance of business and financial education, all the elements that you need in order to become holistically successful, and so so. So when you combine those things, if you, if you're a naturally you're, you're a naturally driven man, which I was you have all this ambition, but you don't. You don't understand anything about yourself because you don't have self-education, you don't have spiritual education, you don't have business and financial education. And fourth, the fourth element is you don't actually know what it means to be a man, because nobody talks to you in those terms and all you have is access to academic education. That's all you have. And you, you and and you, you go through this narrow field of education and it's not satisfying.
Speaker 2:I remember at school I struggled because you know, and, and for many years I believed that I was not smart, because I found I couldn't engage with the education, the structured curriculums, and I really felt like it was producing close-minded people. And over the years now I realize that the education system really doesn't educate, it doesn't empower, it doesn't enable, it doesn't mobilize, it indoctrinates people. So now I look back and I think I was right in thinking that there was something right. This wasn't for me. And then I kind of realized that the only way I'm gonna develop is to seek what else is out there.
Speaker 2:And then, over the years now I have made the determination that for a man, there are four elements that a man needs to achieve competency and mastery in for him to feel joy, joyful, fulfilled and accomplished. And those four elements, as I mentioned earlier, is mastery of self, and we can delve deep into what that means. Mastery of business and financial fundamentals. That's a must because we live in an economic world. I do find that when men deny the importance of money and commercial success because they think that that somehow makes them more spiritual or grounded, I think they suffer because the reality is, whether we like it or not, the world system is currently built around economics. So if you don't understand, you don't have a commercial and financial mind, you will struggle.
Speaker 2:Third part is the spiritual part, which is mastery of spiritual laws. What does that mean? Again, we can delve deep into it if you like. And the fourth part is what does it mean to be masculine? Right Now, one of the things I realized was that when you're a masculine man meaning that you can feel that you have the qualities of leadership, ambition and you have partial dominance, what we're leadership, ambition and you have partial dominance what you're seeing is, over the last two decades, we are seeing a demonizing of those particular personality traits.
Speaker 2:We are seeing that there is a culture that has evolved that automatically assumes that any male who is ambitious and demonstrates leadership qualities or is dominant in nature is toxic. What we're not teaching people is that when it comes to times of crisis or there is a war, you are going to need those men. They are the only men that are going to fight. But what we also need to teach these men is that it's okay to have ambition and dominance, but you need to know how to channel it and control it. Rather than use that dominance to control others, you actually need to use that dominance to control and manage yourself, and I think anything in life that is worth understanding is highly complex and nuanced, and this whole thing around masculinity is also very complex, but we try and simplify it.
Speaker 2:Society comes up with very simple labels and simple descriptions, and I don't think it does any justice.
Speaker 2:So, even though I'm explaining this in in this in simple terms, it's not so simple to really apply, because for a man to understand that, yes, you can be masculine, you can take a lead role, you can be dominant, but that doesn't mean that you need to control people.
Speaker 2:That doesn't mean that you are being controlling of people. That you are, you have a relationship with. The dominance actually means you have to have the ambition and drive to be the best, to excel in what you do, to have a passion for your craft and to be in control of your thoughts and emotions and behaviors, not to be in control of other people's thoughts, emotions and behaviors. And I don't think we make that distinction enough, which is why men are so confused, and so they either feel that they have to give up their masculinity because they don't want to be labeled as toxic, or they become masculine and they demonstrate these controlling behaviors because they think that that's what makes them masculine. And I don't think we. I think men are extremely confused these days, and I think there is a lack of role models who can articulate what it actually means to be a man who is spiritually conscious, intellectually sound, uh and and physically fit and healthy.
Speaker 1:You know, it's a combination of mind, body and spirit when you said that I had just had like these waves of goosebumps, and when I get that, it normally means the person is just nailing, you know, nail on the head, like it's just so. There's so much truth in what you said and it's deep information that that's coming out to the surface, that needs to come to the surface, and I'm tremendously thankful that men like you're out there like really showing other men also how to do that. And do you feel that what you explained here as well, like the mastery of the self, understanding, the, the spiritual laws and also what it means to be masculine, does this all combine in terms of how you feel or perhaps see why people fail to fulfill their definition of success?
Speaker 2:well, yeah, put it this way if I had a, a young son. I have a daughter. My daughter is nine years old. But if I had a son today, what would I be teaching him? Well, I'd be starting with you know.
Speaker 2:I would tell my son that, look, go and learn what you have to learn in school. You need to learn a bit of academics, you need to learn social skills, you need to learn structured training. You need to learn some of those things, and that's important. But when you come home, learn some of those things, and that's important. But when you come home, we're going to. We're going to work on four elements. We're going to work on you understanding who you are, how you work, how does your mind work, how does your subconscious mind work, how your emotions work and the link between your values, strengths sorry, your values and your beliefs and your behaviors.
Speaker 2:I would spend a lot of time on them, because a lot of humans don't actually understand themselves. We don't. We know so little about ourselves. Then I would teach them about consciousness. You know our obligation to the world, our obligation to humanity, understanding not just the physical but the metaphysical, something that you have a lot of passion for and you specialize in, but understanding that everything in the world is made up of physics and matter and energy, and understanding the energetic nature of what it means to be a human being. Third, I would then want them to understand business and financial fundamentals, because in order to be financially successful, you have to be a strategic and lateral thinker, you have to have commercial acumen, and that is also important. You can't just be left brain or right brain, you've got to integrate the two. And then the fourth thing I would teach them the importance of masculine polarity, meaning that it's okay for you to be a man.
Speaker 2:In fact, if you don't understand the elements of masculinity, if you start to dilute them, and when there is less and less difference between the genders, then the attraction is lost. I think there is less and less difference between the genders, then the attraction is lost, right? I think there's a confusion out there in the world. Men and women are equal, but they're different. Let's not pretend that they're the same. They're very different and and we need to maintain and retain those differences rather than pretend that those differences don't exist, because those differences is why they come together in the first place and they gravitate towards each other. Currently, the assumption is made that anyone that wants to highlight the fact that men and women are different is basically trying to stereotype men and women. No, that's not the case. Biologically we're different, the way we behave is different and our differences actually bring us together. The more men start acting like women and women start acting like men, the more it actually starts to erode the attraction between the genders. Yeah right, yeah so. So they're the four elements I would teach my son, you know.
Speaker 2:And then obviously around physical strength. Um, you know, you have to have physical strength. It's important. I mean, there is.
Speaker 2:There is a natural decline in testosterone and sperm count in men if men are not physically healthy, if they don't have that vitality and radiance and that energy. So there is a case for the fact that a man can be a gentleman, can be highly gentle in situations, in social situations, in business situations, with women and children, but also needs to retain the warrior-like qualities. Should there ever be a crisis type of situation, the man needs to be able to tap into it. You know, there's a wonderful saying and I don't know who it's by bruce lee. He said it's better to be a warrior in the garden than to be a gardener in a wall, right, right, yeah, so you.
Speaker 2:So if I have, if I have a son today, that's those types of things I'd be teaching you, and I really feel like I didn't learn those lessons for a long time in my life. You know, I I have learned these lessons through self-discovery. I didn't have a role model to teach me all these lessons, so that's why we felt that, once we understood that, you know, if your man has an understanding of these four elements, you are going to develop men into these holistic human beings who will become strong, you know, leaders, and they're going to become assets to their families. But that's not something that happens naturally, you know. So there has to be a transfer of wisdom from somewhere, and ideally from a place of experience. Um, and you know, experience comes from mistakes and I I can tell you I've made several mistakes and reflected upon them to be to have this level of clarity that I have today and they have and you had that willingness to receive that wisdom, where I'm seeing a lot of people are still not, they're not ready to receive the wisdom.
Speaker 1:Because I'm seeing a lot of people are still not, they're not ready to receive the wisdom because if they receive it, then it's subconsciously. I see with men, in the patterns, with my clients as well, that there's a fear of admitting that they are wrong. There's a fear of admitting that what they've been doing was not right, triggering the sense of failure which they're actually trying to avoid. Feeling like a failure, but at the same time, indirectly, they're actually sabotaging themselves from progressing and growing psychologically and emotionally as well by receiving this guidance as well. And this deeply correlates also with emotions, because men struggle with emotions and it's not because they don't know how to feel it, it's just been so programmed that you're not allowed to feel it. So when the emotions do come up, that's also why it's so very much explosive, because there's not a lot of outlet, healthy outlets, for that as well.
Speaker 1:And where I see this transpires deeply and tremendously is with communication. When men are in a position where they need to communicate, which is not always their strength, this is not stereotypically speaking, because communication means expressing, and men are trained and taught not to express what they feel. It's much more so expressing what their opinion is in terms of trying to do business or something like that. But personal, no. But of course emotions. Personal emotions pour over into whatever it is that we do. Any human being experiences that. What has your experience been with handling all these emotions that sometimes can come up? It's called life. But then also how to funnel and channel that into constructive communication in business as well, because that's where I see a lot of successful men wobble.
Speaker 2:That's where they and that's a lot of questions that I also get from my male clients well, I think the type of men that you may be referring to when you say successful are men who are accomplished in the business world, in the financial world, but do not necessarily demonstrate a level of consciousness when it comes to their own thoughts, emotions and behaviors. With anything, we have to apply distinctions in thinking. I think a man needs to understand his thoughts and emotions and have the ability to be able to strategically express himself. But I also find that there is right now, you know, a lot of women are encouraging men to be expressive and I think you know you have two extremes men who don't express themselves at all and men who are overly expressive because they feel that need to talk about every single thing that they're thinking and feeling. I think the answer is somewhere in the middle. I think a man needs to know what he's thinking and feeling, but he needs to be strategic about what he's sharing, because Because there's a wonderful, you know it's wonderful to be expressive, to have the ability to be able to express your thoughts and emotions. But just because you have the ability to express your thoughts and emotions doesn't mean that you need to express every thought and emotion, because sometimes we need time to digest and reconcile our own emotions as well. So what you'll find is that in the masculine world, men are typically discouraged from expressing. In the feminine world, women will encourage men to express a lot. The answer is somewhere in the middle. A man needs to know when and how to express, rather than express all the time. If you actually start to interview women themselves and women will tell a lot of the times they'll advise men look, you need to be more expressive. But if you actually ask women and if women are being really self-aware and being honest with themselves, a man who's too expressive actually starts to erode his own attractiveness, believe it or not. And so this is where what happens is.
Speaker 2:And again, it's the same thing with ego as well. If a man is dominant, he's naturally going to have some ego. Should he give up all the ego completely? Not necessarily. What he needs to know is he needs to recognize the ego and he needs to recognize where the ego becomes unhealthy. It's not possible for a man to be highly accomplished with some ego. If we're really being honest, you'll never see somebody who is an absolute legend in their field, whether it's in art or music or entertainment or sport. You'll never see somebody who is an absolute legend in their field, whether it's in art or music or entertainment or sport. You'll never see somebody who is an absolute legend in their field without a level of ego, a healthy level of self-respect and high expectations of self.
Speaker 2:But the excessive identification with ego is the problem, and I think this is what concerns me is when people say, oh, he's egotistical, he's got ego. And so the man thinks well, you concerns me is when people say, oh, he's egotistical, he's got ego. And so the man thinks well, you know, I don't want to be called egotistical, so I'll give up all ego. That's not the answer. You've got to retain a healthy level of ego.
Speaker 2:But an excessive attachment to external identity can be the problem. And that's when men, when men have a divorce or when they lose they have a stock market crash or they lose their job or they lose their position those men who have an excessive attachment to the external identity, they're the ones that then become suicidal, violent or they become alcoholics because they don't know how to manage that, because they have excessive attachment. You've got some attachment to the external identity. That's important for us to dominate in the physical world, but an excessive attachment is unhealthy. And I think when people communicate sometimes about these issues, they don't make the distinctions. So the average person takes the message at the surface level and believes that they've understood it. And, as I keep saying, a lot of wisdom is quite nuanced. It's not black and white and people need to understand that. So you know, how can a man maintain a healthy level of ego which is going to drive him forward, which is going to make him excel in his craft, which is going to make him want to compete when he needs to compete? I'm not saying you need to be competitive all the time, but there are times you have to compete Because in the physical world there are still a lot of unconscious energies, right, as much as you know.
Speaker 2:People say love will solve all problems. It doesn't. If love solved all problems, then Mandela would have not been put behind bars, gandhi would have not been assassinated, martin Luther King would have not been assassinated. Martin Luther King would have not been assassinated. There is a time you have to bring love in and then there is a time you have to use a form of aggressive energy to get things done. Sometimes you have to pull, sometimes you have to push. So I'm always wary about any piece of advice which makes it sound extremely simplistic, because what I find is that the more you understand the world, the natural world, the more you understand human nature, the more you realize how complex it is Right.
Speaker 2:And finding that balance is not easy. In no way am I claiming that I have got that balance all the time, but the understanding that the answer is not in any of the extremes makes me want to continue to strive to acquire that wisdom rather than fool myself into believing that I've got it.
Speaker 1:I like I love your honesty in this, because this is what's so much it's needed and is there any guidelines or any tips or signs that you can share that will allow me to really really see I am now in my healthy ego versus the unhealthy ego, because it's such a fine line I would love to hear what was, where was that line for you? What worked for you? What was a healthy balance for you?
Speaker 2:when we use the word science, we have to understand that science a scientific and rational approach typically works with physical evidence only right. Typically it needs. It emphasizes anything that we can identify with through our sensory factors. Some things go beyond science. So one of the things for me, for example, is I have an identity, an internal identity, and I have an external identity. My internal identity is my purpose, my passion, my values, my strengths, my zone of genius and my goals. That's my internal identity. My external identity is my occupation, my title, my name, my nationality, my heritage and my accomplishments. That's my external identity. I need both. I need an internal identity and I need an external identity Right. When a man has the right alignment, he has more of his self-esteem coming from his internal identity than his external identity. So, for example, if I was to be stripped of my external identity and I start feeling suicidal or I lose my confidence, then that basically means that I have worked too hard on building my external identity, but I've neglected my internal identity. However, at the same time, if somebody strips me of my occupation, my financial status and my accomplishments, but I can still maintain a sense of calm and confidence and courage, and what that basically says is that I have more of my identity derived from my internal identity and less from my external identity. That means I have less attachment to the ego. Yeah, right, what you find is when and men typically see women express their emotions typically through sadness or, you know, tears, but men express their same energy through anger. What is anger, though? If you really understand what anger is? Anger is a feeling that a man feels when he fears losing something or someone the underlying emotion of fear and when a man feels that something external is about to be taken away from them that's going to strip them of their external identity, that's when that fear of losing someone or something kicks in, and that's when a man expresses anger. Okay, and anger, as we know, for a man, especially if it's not being directed properly, can be extremely destructive. Right, and that will always happen when a man has more of his identity acquired through the external rather than the internal. I mean, we all need an external identity to function as human beings in the world. I need an external.
Speaker 2:When you introduced me, you know, you said ron, is this this? This? He's a speaker, he's a wealth advisor. How do I feel when I listen to this nice, but not like, oh my god, how incredible. Am I right?
Speaker 2:I like the fact that I have been able to achieve certain things in the physical world, but I'm also very conscious about the fact that I don't want that to define who I am Right Partially, not totally Right, and so my ability to be able to make that distinction in my mind is important. At all times, I must remind myself that, no matter what I accomplish in the physical world, that the predominantly who I am is defined by my internal identity. And as long as I remember that, I will always remain grounded right. And my favorite, one of my favorite expressions is how can I keep my feet firmly on the ground but keep my head up in the clouds at the same time, meaning I still want to have a vision. I don't want to diminish myself to the point where I have no vision. I want to have a grand vision for my life my head's in the clouds, but at the same time, I must keep my feet firmly on the ground, and this is what I find with pretty much everything in life.
Speaker 2:There's this ability to integrate two opposing forces, so important for people to understand that, because there's a natural polarity that exists in the universe and in life, and anytime you are gravitating towards any of the extremes, you suffer needlessly. The ability to integrate those polarities is. It requires mindfulness, right? So, and it amazes me, you know, here I'm at the age of 44 and I look at a lot of young men. You know, a lot of young men come to me and I said to them you know, what do you want? I want to be a millionaire, I want to have a private jet. I want to have, I want to be, I want to date a lot of young women. Okay, that's all fine, but it's it's very superficial.
Speaker 1:It's okay, that's going to give you a lot of pleasure, but it's not going to give you joy you know, and something that deeply taking from what you're saying here as well, is if I had to take it in my own words is, at the end of the day, it's about living your life and having the balance that, if you did, for example, lose the external self, would you be happy with the internal self?
Speaker 2:and if the answer is yes, then you have found your place of balance well, the thing is, you can build everything in the external as long as you retain the internal. So if I lost my business and I lost my net worth, I lost my. Anything that I'll lose in the physical world I can recreate as long as the internal state is still aligned and consolidated. And that can only happen if I'm putting more work into the internal than I'm putting into the external. If I neglect the internal and the external gets taken away from me, then all of a sudden I will suffer from a significant loss of identity, which is then going to manifest itself into fear and be expressed as anger.
Speaker 1:You know when you did touch there on this, that part as well, where it's important to look at this internal and to nurture that, because what I'm seeing this year already, I'm seeing this year is a year of resurrection, but a year of emotional resurrection, and I'm seeing this especially with men. I almost feel women are actually going a little bit the opposite. It's like they've taken a bit of a step back and I feel men are finally like making a wonderful headway in terms of finding that inner balance and they're starting to just intuitively doing that themselves.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I have empathy for women though, because I do feel that a woman, when she is not around enough masculine energy, she will end up stepping into the masculine energy. Yeah, okay, and I think, and that's why I really believe, that it's up to men. It is hard for men because, you know, I mean, one of the things you'll find is that in a society, a young male has the least value. In a society, women and children have more value. Okay, if something happens to a young male, for example, on the streets, it won't get a lot of coverage in the media, but if something happens to a female or a child, it'll get a lot more coverage. So, as a whole, we don't even realize this. Unconsciously, we do place a lot of value on the lives of women and children, and so we should.
Speaker 2:And but a lot of men feel like they're being neglected. A lot of men are starting to feel a bit resentful because they feel like they're not being acknowledged, they're not being recognized, and it's a double-edged sword. On one hand, we can't blame women for this, and men have to take responsibility here, and a lot of men don't want to take responsibility because the sense of entitlement has kicked in as well, the reality is it is harder for men and it should be harder for men. It should be. It shouldn't be easier for men because that's when, if you really want to get in connection with your own masculinity, do the hard stuff. You're not going to get to experience the power of your masculinity unless you do the hard stuff. So it is actually hard for men these days. And we're not talking about because when women talk about the fact that you know, women are disadvantaged and men have advantages, they forget the fact that 80 of men don't have that advantage. It's only the men at the top oh, yeah, yeah 80 of the men have no advantage.
Speaker 2:They're actually, in fact, in many cases, are worse off than women in many, in many cases. But yeah, there are men at the top. I mean, the world is dominated by men, but let's not forget that only 20 of the men, 80 of the men, don't have any dominance in life, and so we have to keep that in mind and I think, I think for me it's very important that a man does learn the hard stuff, because that's when he will build that character. You can't build character if you take the easy way.
Speaker 1:You just can't and I love what you said there again and I want to dive a little bit into that is to build the emotions, is to build with the emotions of the heart center. Because did you find that there was a difference? Because I know you're a heart person, that's why you just jumped out at me from all the people that I really wanted to connect with and did you find that being in your heart center made a difference when working with people, not just now, clients. I'm talking about your internal system, because this is where I find a lot of men in business and in leadership. They don't have a dynamic with their team members. They don't have a dynamic with their team members. They don't have a connection or a bond professional bond, of course, but with their people and they have a high turnover in their businesses.
Speaker 2:people don't stay very long well, that's because most men tend to be more left brain dominated and you know, and a lot of men choose occupations that also emphasizes the left brain function, for example, like in financial services and wealth management. You know, I was very left brain, left brained in the way I. You know, I analyze situations and I rationalize situations. The development of the right brain, or the intuitive faculties to match the intellectual faculties, has come from learning through my own mentors and then being able to integrate the two. What you'll see is typically in the workforce.
Speaker 2:If you're seeing male leaders, you'll see one or the other. I've seen both. I've seen both extremes males who are highly left-brained, dominant, use a push-based approach, and then you're also seeing a lot of males who are softer, using a only or predominantly a right, right brain approached, uh, highly intuitive, highly consensus-based both extremes. Again, you need to know when to pull and when to push. Pull is not the answer for every situation and neither is pushing. Yes, predominantly men use pushing, but there's a whole. There's been a massive emergence of a whole new generation of men that actually hate the men on this side. They don't like they don't want to be one of these males they
Speaker 2:are averse to the corporate system, they're averse to marketing, they're averse to money, they're averse to ambition.
Speaker 2:So what we're seeing is that these men have always been there in society, but now we're seeing an emergence of these men here who are embracing their feminine side, which is wonderful. But we're not seeing a lot of men who are able to integrate the two. We're still seeing this, you know, heavy, masculine, non-expressive left brain dominating others, energy. And then we've seen this one which is too consensus based, is afraid to lead, afraid to take responsibility uh, it's way too feminine, um, and. And so it's about how do you, how do you, integrate these two?
Speaker 2:And so we've had the pendulum in one direction for so long and now it's completely swung in the other direction. In many cases, we've got to just try and center it somewhere in the middle uh, integrate elements from both uh and and um and have men who, who are not just intuitive and highly connected within themselves and expressive, but they can also, when it's time to lead and when it's time to fight, and when it's time to take control and it's time to take responsibility, they can do that as well Because, as I've said to you time and time again, when times are prosperous and easy, there is no need for the man who is going to fight and dominate.
Speaker 1:But in times of crisis, you're going to need these men and we have to be very careful that we don't strip them of their masculinity, because the future generations will pay a price, because there will be a time of crisis and the men on the right side are not going to rise up. You know that balance that you just touched on there. That is something that I'm seeing more and more and more today. And one thing that I'm also seeing with the younger generation and I would love your insight or any advice here, because I'm sure we're going to have a wide variety of people here with us with this interview. I'm seeing a lot of the younger generations also coming in and it's almost like there's a competition between them. Who couldn't just care less. There's almost a sense of passivity that's now taking place, just waiting for things just to be handed to them. There's no almost. Where men went from being working extremely hard there's now like, well, how little can I do for as much as possible. I'm also seeing this now coming forward and it's actually ruining their careers.
Speaker 2:Well, it's true, the entitlement culture has infiltrated our society and our education system. The thing about the human mind that we need to understand is that the human mind can rationalize any belief we can In the person's mind who is entitled. They can easily justify why they should be entitled. They can attribute that to how their ancestors were treated. They can attribute to anything right, but the reality is that those who are not big on personal accountability have very difficult lives in the long term. That is a fact. I mean you can act entitled In the short to medium term, you might get more than you deserve, but in the long term, you end up actually destroying your character. So personal accountability is is harder. It's harder because you know, um, I don't believe in the victim code mentality and I some people think that I'm being a bit too. Maybe I'm being too harsh, but the thing is, what the person who would accuse me of being harsh doesn't understand is that I'm actually saying it for their own benefit. You are diminishing the power of your own spirit by wanting to be a victim. I mean, you can be a victim for the short term, but when you're a victim for the long term, that's typically a choice. So I'm dead against that victim mentality personally and that lack of personal accountability, because it ruins you. It actually ruins your potential and your capability. It may make you feel good in the short to medium term, but you're creating a very difficult life for yourself in the long term. So, from that perspective, I think it's children or young people. Youth are very misguided in believing that they should be given things I mean, I'm not in favor of being given a trophy for participation or things like that and I think again, all of this is happening because there is this belief that this need to dominate and compete is a negative and toxic characteristic. In some situations, yes, but not in all situations. Because you think about the fact that we would never see examples of legendary performance in sport, music, entertainment unless the individual was highly competitive and had a domineering streak. You would not see a person like Serena Williams, you would not see a Michael Jordan, you would not see a Michael Jackson. These people had this need to be the best.
Speaker 2:When we start to tell everybody that everybody is the same and everybody should be created equal again, we're not making distinctions in thinking. Yes, everybody is equal when it comes to the spirit, but when it comes to the mind. They're not right. We should all be created the same, all human spirit. Everybody deserves respect because of the spirit that they have, but how, what you do with your mind will depend on whether you're not. You get that respect in the physical world, so we.
Speaker 2:So some forms of discrimination are completely not on. I mean, you should never discriminate based on gender color, because those things people can't choose. But but but it may sometimes be necessary to discriminate based on something that is a choice. For example, if I, if you don't give me a job at the salary that I want, should I accuse you of discrimination? No, I may not be good enough to earn that salary. Yeah, yeah. So I'm a big believer. I I feel that the entitlement mindset, in any of its manifestation, is highly destructive to human potential. But one of my favorite words is the word earn. Earn respect, earn influence, earn authority, earn status, earn money. Don't expect it for free. So that's why I talk about men should be aiming to do the hard stuff, because of the character and confidence that it builds, which then nobody can take away from you if you don't do the hard stuff and you get the good stuff, if the good stuff ever gets taken away from you, you will find that you will not have the character of strength to be able to withstand it.
Speaker 1:And I love what you also said there about not allowing people to stand in place of being a victim, and I don't think that you're being harsh because, honestly, I have the exact same approach and I even wrote about this in many of my books, where I don't allow people to be in that place of being a victim.
Speaker 1:They're needing to understand that whatever it is that made them feel like a victim was a passing experience, but that's in the past now as well. It doesn't even exist anymore and people tend to identify themselves with something that happened in the past. It's no longer real if we keep it alive by creating that identity, but it's a false identity that people end up placing on themselves. And that identity, of course, you start to live your life from that place in space. So of course now you're not aligning yourself with success, to your greatness, to your purpose. You're doing the actual opposite. You're deprogramming yourself to your greatness, to your purpose. You're doing the actual opposite. You're deprogramming yourself from your greatness as well. So that's a tremendously important point that you made there as well.
Speaker 2:And how our mind and you perfectly articulate it. They're just replaying the recording of a past event and they're attaching their identity Again. That's a form of ego. By the way, any attachment to the external identity is ego. Even that is ego. People don't realize that.
Speaker 1:So you're right. I love that even being an ego is being a victim, because a lot of people and that's what people do with shame as well I see people who are very shy. People say, oh well, they have a low self-esteem, they're very shy and this and that. What I'm actually seeing in the reverse of that is actually someone who is very controlling in terms of how people see them, so they'd much rather hide and go into overcompensating of not being out there with the fear of being judged. But that's also coming from a place of ego. A lot of people see passivity as being a place of powerlessness, but of course, in to a certain degree it is, but that's also ego well, that's right and that's why I was saying that.
Speaker 2:You know, there's a new, there's nuanced thinking required because in some situations being passive equals being calm. Okay, and it demonstrates an inner character and strength. In situations, being passive could indicate neutrality and lack of courage To know when to be what comes with experience. And this is the thing People want. Sometimes they want a very black and white answer to a very complex question and sometimes there isn't. It comes from experience. In this situation, it's perfectly fine for me and necessary for me to be passive, but in this situation I must be assertive, right To know that to make those distinctions come from experience. It comes from some trials and errors.
Speaker 1:But, again.
Speaker 2:The individual who is on the quest for truth and wisdom will eventually find the answers to those questions. Any individual who is not driven by truth and wisdom will eventually find the answers to those questions. Any individual who is not driven by truth and wisdom is not going to experience clarity on those and will live a life of confusion.
Speaker 1:You know, it's a hit and nail on the head again there. And one thing that I'm also seeing here, ron, is and I would love your insight on this, because this is a big problem that I'm seeing especially in the male environment with the careers is especially during lockdown. We had now a lot of people a lot of time they read books, they do something that would make them feel, oh wow, now I can teach someone how to build a business. But they read one book, maybe they did one online course. Now they're suddenly, they're an expert and they're marketing themselves as that, and the internet is now saturated with these people who don't really know what they're doing do. How can we go out there and find the right mentors and leaders and supporters and differentiate the real deal between the people who are just now trying to make it out there, that's trying to make fast money?
Speaker 2:okay, there's always going to be people who are going to take shortcuts in life, you know. But if you fold more than once, then the problem is you. You don't have the ability to be able to decipher and differentiate between those who have theoretical learning versus people who've got deep experience. And if you're inexperienced yourself, how are you going to make that determination Right so you can have all? You can have an entire industry dominated by corrupt people or inauthentic people, but that doesn't mean anything. The people who are fooled are fools. I'm sorry, but if you, if you're fooled over and over again, you're the fool.
Speaker 2:There is a case for people to have the ability. It's not easy to fool somebody like me. I have experience, I'm a thinker, I evaluate things, I critically, analyze them for myself. I am highly conscious of being indoctrinated. I'm self-aware. So what we do as a society is we keep blaming the people who are fooling, and they always will. That's just how it is. If, if world was a big jungle, you're going to have some sheep and you're going to have some wolves in there, but you can't keep blaming the wolves for acting like wolves. At some point you've got to wise it up and go. I mean, how naive are you to think that the world should have no wolves in it? Right to expect that oh, you know what the people in politics and people in education and people in corporate are always going to do the right thing by us. I mean, how naive are you to even expect that? That says something about your naivety more than it says something about people's lack of integrity, right?
Speaker 2:and to me again comes back to personal accountability. How much are you going to keep blaming people? It's just the way it is. The world is very imperfect and it has problems, and your job is to identify how this world works and how life works, how natural world works, how you work, and put the odds in your favor by becoming wise. You can't police everything in the world. You can put all kinds of regulations in every industry, it's not going to fix the problem. I mean, the financial services industry is notorious for financial scandals.
Speaker 2:And they have, regulation after regulation after regulation after regulation. All that is done, it's made the cost of financial advice unaffordable for most people. Now, you can't police everything in the world. It is up to the individual to become wise and protect themselves. But individuals who refuse to learn to seek truth and wisdom, to seek experience, will constantly remain naive. And if it's not one person, it's going to be somebody else that's going to fool them, you know. That's why there's a saying fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.
Speaker 1:Exactly, and I think that's also what you said earlier about importance of self-mastery, because when we start that path and you become clearer of who you are, you become clearer of what you also want to align with and then becoming an energetic match to that and actually just automatically feeling aligned to people that will elevate you to that place where you want to be or what you are looking for to accomplish or to learn or to educate yourself in well, that's right.
Speaker 2:And I think and that's why I keep coming back to the quest for truth and quest for wisdom it starts with with the question what is the truth? Because unless you ask that question, you're never even going to move towards it, you know. That's why you have to be a seeker first. I mean, I'm a seeker of truth and wisdom, so I'm naturally I don't take things on face value. I'm not a highly skeptical person. I have a healthy level of skepticism. You have to operate, function well in the world. You have to have a reasonable level of trust in people. But you can't be naive. Again, it's that middle. You know. You can be true trusting or be too skeptical.
Speaker 2:And again, most people are again one of those two quadrants, rather than being in the center where you can evaluate things. And that's why there is no black and white answer to some of life's questions. It's something that you only sense and you understand through diversity of experience. And you know you can't rely on books to give you everything, because you have to experience. Experiential learning is everything you know. When I embody what I teach, there is a much deeper connection than if I'm just speaking from my mind. See, I'm able to put context around what I'm saying, and I'm able to identify the nuances in what I'm saying because it's coming from a place of experience rather than theoretical learning. So those who continually opt for theoretical learning and don't really throw themselves into the experience have a fear of failure. And unless you're able to conquer that fear of failure, you'll never deeply integrate the learnings. And if you can't deeply integrate the learnings, you cannot cause transformation in other people. Because you're speaking from the head, you've got to speak from the soul, and that's why experience is necessary.
Speaker 1:It happens something, really Tell me.
Speaker 2:I just want to quickly add Experience by itself is not sufficient. It's experience combined with self-reflection, because a lot of people are experienced. They're older than us, they've experienced more life. That doesn't necessarily mean they're wiser than us. So it's not experience by itself that makes you wise, it's reflected experience that makes you wise. So when you experience something and then you reflect on it, that's what makes you wise, and I don't think a lot of people do that. And so what they do and the ultimate price that they they pay is that they never get to experience wisdom. And if they don't get to experience wisdom, they remain in a state of confusion and doubt, and you know from that place again, when you're in a state of confusion and doubt, you're still. The underlying emotion that you're operating from is the emotion of fear.
Speaker 1:So for me, the quest for wisdom and truth equals confidence, and that's why, to me, that's the most important thing that's, and I fully, fully agree with you, and I want to ask you do you feel that one of the reasons men struggle with self-reflection is because now we go within and it could potentially mean that there's things now that we don't want to see about ourselves, that we're trying to avoid, because most of our lives is set up with coping mechanisms. It's set up in a way to be in a place, in a state of avoidance, and we have to break these cycles now of being in this comfortable place of avoidance, and self-reflection means that this is already a very potent and powerful step to start to break these subconscious patterning and cycles that we've set ourselves up for. Is there any advice that you can give for men who can, so that they can start to reflect more? Is there any practice that you do, or meditation that you do, or a thought process that you even hold, or affirmations that you that you would repeat for yourself?
Speaker 2:I do. But the thing is this if, if, if I, if I tell you what the practices I do, it doesn't necessarily mean that men are going to apply it. Young men typically struggle in applying these practices because testosterone is rushing through their body and when testosterone is running expression through their body, they're thinking from their body. They're not really thinking, and so I you know. And so the first thing is a man has to understand you know the function of testosterone because it does tend to dominate a man's thinking if it's not under control.
Speaker 2:Now what happens is the young men typically don't spend enough time reflecting because they want to have sex and they want to get into fights, because there's all this rushing through their blood, right, a lot of men at the same time have developed bad habits. They're in an uninspiring job for two or three decades. So at the middle age a lot of men have very low testosterone, so they've got the opposite problem. So here you've got very high testosterone but not the ability to channel it, and here you've got very low testosterone where you've actually lost your drive for life. So in both situations, both these men are not going to spend enough time in self-reflection because they don't even understand what's happening inside of them. They don't even know that testosterone too much or the lack of is the issue. They don't understand biologically what's happening inside of them, right? So the first recognition is the fact that if you have either of the extreme, you need to understand what's actually happening inside of you, physiologically, biologically, what's actually happening inside of you. So I spend time in solitude and you know, every day I have spent time in solitude and I never, ever, feel lonely because I'm connected within myself.
Speaker 2:So the first sign of a man who is, who has a real issue, is that man who cannot spend time by himself, he needs to constantly have some stimulation, whether it's social, it's online. He needs physical stimulation. He's unable to just sit with himself for long periods of time. So if I recommended the practice of solitude, do you think a lot of men are going to do it? No, they're not going to do it. If their testosterone drive is extremely low or it's excessive, they're not going to be able to do it, and the reason for that is they don't have the awareness to know what's happening.
Speaker 2:The other issue that we're finding now is that one of the reasons why men don't self-reflect is because when men are feeling depressed. The pornography addiction is very high now, extremely high. So a man is then trying to get some sort of a physical hit or a dopamine hit by watching pornography for a short period of time and rather than sitting in silence and reflecting in solitude, which is in the beginning. It's very difficult because if your mind is highly stimulated and you're constantly either at work or you're with friends or you're watching sport, all of a sudden just to sit down by yourself and not do anything requires a tremendous amount of self-control. So you're going to have all this. You know you're going to have an each, you're going to have this, so you're going to want to go to the fridge and grab something to eat.
Speaker 2:So to be able to sit for long periods of time is not easy, but I highly recommend it as a practice, because when a man is in calm control of himself, he is extremely powerful, and then he can take that testosterone, he can start to increase its reserves and he can start to redirect it to more creative endeavors. So you know, but that comes with practice. First you've got to have the willingness and you've got to have the understanding that this is what's happening inside of you, and then you've got to have the desire to be a man who wants to be in control of himself. I have no desire to control people. Okay, there are. There are times when I have to control various functions in business. I have to control performance, I have to control behaviors right but I don't want more than I have to right.
Speaker 2:Okay, in general, for me the main goal is to be in control of my thoughts, my emotions and my behaviors self-mastery. You know, the enemy outside is nothing compared to the enemy within right and I must conquer the enemy within first this was such a powerful interview, rod.
Speaker 1:I know that you are a very busy man, but if I may ask just one more question is there any message before I let you go, any message that you would love to share with men out there right now who are in business? Who's just feeling? You know that feeling that you're in your business, you don't know what's wrong, you just feel stuck, you're not happy, you don't feel motivated anymore. But we all go through that phase where we just feel blah, like we can't put our finger on that. What the core issue might be and it's not about what is the core issue, it's about how can men perhaps start to move out of that place of stuckness I find that one of the ways I have developed my faculty of intuition.
Speaker 2:So please understand that as a man especially if you're an intelligent man, you will typically would have you would spend a lot of time developing your intellect. But to balance that off so that you are not getting so stuck in your own head, you need to develop your intuitive senses, and you do that with the practice of meditation. So I do what I. When I do my meditation practice, what I do is I don't think of anything. I allow an infinite intelligence to drop ideas in my mind rather than me coming up with my own ideas. So there is time that I spend in self-reflection and strategizing. There are times when I just reflect in the mode of receiving. I just want to receive guidance.
Speaker 2:I don't believe that I have all the answers.
Speaker 2:I look at my background and I see how many mistakes I have made when I've been overly reliant on my own intellect, because I think it was Einstein that said that the intellect creates as many problems as it solves.
Speaker 2:So one of the things that men need to understand is that intellect is not the answer for every problem, just like a hammer is not the only tool you need to build a house.
Speaker 2:Intellect cannot be the solution to every problem that you have. You need to sometimes tap into your intuitive faculties, and the best method to do that is to, number one, spend time in solitude and silence in a meditative state. But secondly, when you do get epiphany moments, to recognize them and to be grateful for them. The more you grateful for them, the more you recognize them, the more you're grateful, the more frequently you're going to start to get these epiphany moments and they'll guide you. And so when I am stuck with the problem where I'm constantly trying, trying, trying and it's not going away, it is a perfect, it's a hint for me that I need to back off from the problem completely and not use my own head to solve it and allow an intelligence to divinely guide me by making space in my head for it. Now, minds are too cluttered that intuitive intelligence can't work through us. So that would be the advice that I would give men who are intelligent and tend to get in their own way.
Speaker 1:I'm actually going to follow that advice too. That was wonderful. Thank you so much, ron, and I want to thank you. Advice too, that was wonderful. Thank you so much, ron, and I want to thank you also for your time. Thank you for all the love and the energy that you pour into people, because I love that you are also a heart-centered man, successful man in business, and I love that you're lighting the way and showing this path and the possibility of this path to other men as well. So a deeply thank you for everything that you also do for humanity and the contribution that you bring to the emotional education not just intellectual education, but the emotional education, because that is fundamentally important and so direly needed right now. So I wish we could clone you. We can have more of you. And thank you also for teaching other men exactly how to do that as well, with ease and with grace well, thank you.
Speaker 2:thank you for creating a platform, and if it wasn't for you and your recognition of the problem, I wouldn't have the ability to be able to express what I've expressed today. So thank you for creating the platform and being so. And there's, as a woman, the fact that you wish to empower and enable men, and it's a lot of work to organize these events and get people in. I appreciate the fact that you've done that and thank you for being so positive. I love the research that you have done because I have been studying that for so long and I'm always so disappointed when people are dismissive of the power of the metaphysical. I'm so disappointed how sometimes the people who consider themselves to be highly rational and scientific are so quick to dismiss this element of what it?
Speaker 2:means of what it means. It's disappointing because if men would just open up their minds and hearts to understanding the metaphysical, it would just take them to the whole, a whole new level, and I speak from experience. So, uh, I would, uh I guess I'll take the opportunity to tell people who are listening, um, to check out the stuff, the work that you have done, the research that you have done they have. It seems to me it doesn't even make sense why they've taken this out of the education system. But I can attribute a lot of my accomplishments, my clarity that I have, to an understanding of my metaphysical nature. So I'll take the opportunity to recommend the fact that people check out the work that you have to an understanding of my metaphysical nature. So I'll take the opportunity to recommend the fact that people check out the work that you have done, and I appreciate that you invited me on this platform. Thank you.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much, john. I look forward to more interviews because I love your mastermind and to also bring out what you do for other men there as well, and hopefully to see you one day here in Bali. I'm very excited.
Speaker 2:And a big thank you to.